Adelaide City Council footpath parking trial - Survey

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Adelaide City Council footpath parking trial - Survey

Post  Chook on Tue 11 Oct 2016, 6:12 pm


The Adelaide City Council is running a survey until October 21 in regards to the current trail of motorcycle parking on (some) footpaths

If you want to participate, you need to register on their site first
http://yoursay.adelaidecitycouncil.com/scooter-parking-trial?tool=survey_tool&tool_id=scooter-parking-trial-form&ts=1476169508#tool_tab

The last question has to be answered within the scope of the "guiding principles" which are very restrictive

ACC wrote:Guiding principles
The following guiding principles have been adopted to identify
locations that may be suitable for motorcycle and scooter parking on
footpaths:
 Low pedestrian volumes
 Not located along a pedestrian desire line
 Not impeding on pedestrian mobility
 Does not create conflicts with existing (or possible future)
landscaping/greening and outdoor dining
 Adequate space to accommodate 10 or more motorcycles or
scooters
 The demand is there for motorcycle and scooter parking
(office/commercial precincts)
 The space is in essence considered to have low potential for
other uses
 Does not significantly impact on the visual amenity of the area.
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Re: Adelaide City Council footpath parking trial - Survey

Post  madmax on Tue 11 Oct 2016, 8:22 pm

Looks as though they are trying to make it as hard as possible to get it off the ground, then they can say "sorry folks we tried it and it failed"

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Re: Adelaide City Council footpath parking trial - Survey

Post  2wheelsagain on Wed 12 Oct 2016, 6:35 am

10 or mor motorcycles is a frigging joke.

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Re: Adelaide City Council footpath parking trial - Survey

Post  Chook on Wed 12 Oct 2016, 7:25 am

@2wheelsagain wrote:10 or mor motorcycles is a frigging joke.

There's a few on that list that are nothing but a joke 2WA, IMHO the only reason we are getting any at all is so they can reduce the dedicated motorcycle parks (which are free in Adelaide) reverting them back to timed car parks, that = more revenue for the ACC
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Re: Adelaide City Council footpath parking trial - Survey

Post  barry_mcki on Wed 12 Oct 2016, 9:26 am

Plus you'd have to paint all your bikes red to conform with the last requirement  Very Happy

 Does not significantly impact on the visual amenity of the area.

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Re: Adelaide City Council footpath parking trial - Survey

Post  2wheelsagain on Wed 12 Oct 2016, 11:17 am

Victorian rules are very simple and its mandated in state legislation.
~ Vicroad website ~

Footpath parking
In Victoria, you can park your motorcycle on a footpath, unless there is a sign saying you can't. When parking you must not get in the way, or block the path of pedestrians, delivery vehicles, public transport users or parked cars.

On-street motorcycle parking bays are available in Melbourne's Central Business District(External link) and other urban areas throughout Victoria.

The responsibility for the enforcement of footpath parking lies with Councils. To find out more about your local parking laws, visit Local Councils(External link). Penalties will apply if you park in motorcycle excluded areas.
~

There are very few excluded areas. They are well signed and usually dedicated parking is close by. Why does SA or ACC try to re-invent the wheel?

In the early 80's we were motivated enough to occupy every car space in the CBD over a couple of weekends. 1 bike per space as per the law at the time. That quickly showed the benefits of footpath parking.

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Re: Adelaide City Council footpath parking trial - Survey

Post  Chook on Wed 12 Oct 2016, 12:11 pm

@2wheelsagain wrote:

Why does SA or ACC try to re-invent the wheel?


Nanny State mentality, way too many wowsers that oppose change / development just for the sake of it.
The same reasons we have to put up / pull down all of the Clipsal 500 infrastructure every year
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Re: Adelaide City Council footpath parking trial - Survey

Post  madmax on Wed 12 Oct 2016, 1:00 pm

@2wheelsagain wrote:Victorian rules are very simple and its mandated in state legislation.
~ Vicroad website ~

Footpath parking
In Victoria, you can park your motorcycle on a footpath, unless there is a sign saying you can't. When parking you must not get in the way, or block the path of pedestrians, delivery vehicles, public transport users or parked cars.

On-street motorcycle parking bays are available in Melbourne's Central Business District(External link) and other urban areas throughout Victoria.

The responsibility for the enforcement of footpath parking lies with Councils. To find out more about your local parking laws, visit Local Councils(External link). Penalties will apply if you park in motorcycle excluded areas.
~

There are very few excluded areas. They are well signed and usually dedicated parking is close by. Why does SA or ACC try to re-invent the wheel?

In the early 80's we were motivated enough to occupy every car space in the CBD over a couple of weekends. 1 bike per space as per the law at the time. That quickly showed the benefits of footpath parking.



Isn't there also something in there about distance from shop walls and kerbside as well?

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Re: Adelaide City Council footpath parking trial - Survey

Post  madmax on Wed 12 Oct 2016, 1:01 pm

@Chook wrote:
@2wheelsagain wrote:

Why does SA or ACC try to re-invent the wheel?


Nanny State mentality, way too many wowsers that oppose change / development just for the sake of it.
The same reasons we have to put up / pull down all of the Clipsal 500 infrastructure every year

You can't be the nanny state, we are! Crying or Very sad

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Re: Adelaide City Council footpath parking trial - Survey

Post  Chalkie on Wed 12 Oct 2016, 3:47 pm

I nearly got pinged in the city because I had parked on a footpath between two brass discs embedded in the footpath. Didn't realise that meant I was blocking streetside cafe tables and chairs for when they opened later that morning. Only just escaped the grey ghosts and an angry cafe owner. 
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Re: Adelaide City Council footpath parking trial - Survey

Post  2wheelsagain on Wed 12 Oct 2016, 4:52 pm

@Chalkie wrote:I nearly got pinged in the city because I had parked on a footpath between two brass discs embedded in the footpath. Didn't realise that meant I was blocking streetside cafe tables and chairs for when they opened later that morning. Only just escaped the grey ghosts and an angry cafe owner. 

That sounds like there were no signs saying you couldn't park there though.

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Re: Adelaide City Council footpath parking trial - Survey

Post  Chalkie on Wed 12 Oct 2016, 5:03 pm

You're right 2WA, no signage except for these brass discs about the size of tennis balls in the footpath. I rarely go into the city and didn't have a clue about them. Top of Elizabeth Street, the other end being a bit of a bikie Mecca.
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Re: Adelaide City Council footpath parking trial - Survey

Post  madmax on Wed 12 Oct 2016, 8:36 pm

No signs then the ticket wouldn't stand up in court.

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Re: Adelaide City Council footpath parking trial - Survey

Post  2wheelsagain on Wed 12 Oct 2016, 9:27 pm

@Chalkie wrote:You're right 2WA, no signage except for these brass discs about the size of tennis balls in the footpath. I rarely go into the city and didn't have a clue about them. Top of Elizabeth Street, the other end being a bit of a bikie Mecca.
Under legislation we can park on the footpath unless theres a sign saying we can't. Discs in the pavement won't cut it and the Grey Ghost knew it. Good job on moving though as no harm done.

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Re: Adelaide City Council footpath parking trial - Survey

Post  Chook on Fri 12 May 2017, 10:39 pm

While we haven't got state wide footpath parking, the Adelaide City Council trial is over and it has been expanded to include more locations within the CBD

http://www.cityofadelaide.com.au/explore-the-city/city-travelling-transport/parking/motorcycle-parking

In addition to those "off street" locations there are over 1000 free "on street" spaces in the CBD, unfortunately you need to get in early to secure one and 1/2 the time you end up with someone's bloody moped/scooter double parked blocking you in.

Still it's a step in the right direction, now the MRA-SA and RTR lobby groups have been successful in getting lane filtering and new helmet laws through, per\haps it's time for a push fore state wide footpath parking similar to Victoria
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Re: Adelaide City Council footpath parking trial - Survey

Post  paul on Fri 12 May 2017, 11:02 pm

Yay ........some common sense prevailing at last ..................I have also noticed most drivers seem to be doing the right thing with regards to filtering ; despite the distinct  lack of media publicity letting them know the law has changed.  Rolling Eyes

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Re: Adelaide City Council footpath parking trial - Survey

Post  Chook on Sat 13 May 2017, 8:14 am

@paul wrote:Yay ........some common sense prevailing at last ..................I have also noticed most drivers seem to be doing the right thing with regards to filtering ; despite the distinct  lack of media publicity letting them know the law has changed.  Rolling Eyes

The Ride to Review group asked the question earlier this week, "now we've been successful; with helmet legislation and lane filtering, what would you want RTR to campaign for now?"

That was one of the things I suggested


BTW paul, as your not a facebooker, not sure if you'd be familiar with RTR.

RTR is a facebook group that "appears" to be doing more serious campaigning for motorcyclists than our traditional advocacy group, the MRASA who have in the past done a great job but appear "tired" with a distinct lack of drive and no apparent accountability.

Tim Kelly started the RTR group after becoming disenchanted with with what appears to be a lack of action  from the MRA (which I am also a member of btw, not sure how long for though), the MRA has also gained a reputation of becoming an "old boys club"

It is free to be a member of RTR (as long as you are on FB you are welcome) and opinions are heard and acknowledged. I'm also on the MRA page, no public posting allowed on that one.

Last year a few of the more active members applied to join the MRA (their constitution say you have to have your application accepted at the next committee meeting) and there was a fairly public campaign to get members of RTR to join the MRA to give a couple of them some votes in the 2017 AGM to try and breath some new life into the MRA.

This was Tim's public push to get RTR members to join the MRA

FB post regarding joining MRA wrote:~ Why Join the MRASA and Support a New Committee ~
RTR was started by motorcyclists, for motorcyclists, just over 20 months ago with the sole goal of seeking better representation for motorcycling in SA government decision making.
Along with this, 3 major tasks where set for the group to achieve.
1. The Legalisation of ECE Helmets,
2. The Legalisation of Lane Filtering, and
3. Simplified control rules for motorcyclists.
Today, 20 months later, 2 of those 3 tasks are complete with the third being progressed along and hopefully, completed by mid 2017. However, for almost every task RTR has undertaken, the MRASA has chosen not to engage with RTR, help represent us or seek to consult within our (and by extension, their own) riding community.
This is in direct conflict of the aims of the their own organisation, which, as per the constitution are
(a) To provide a link between motorcyclists, government, other authorities and the general public.
(b) To support other motorcycling bodies that work for the betterment of motorcycling.
Most recently, the RTR Lane Filtering submission was slandered, by proxy, with no justification, yet the submission was in support of the very same objective the MRASA were seeking.
This is counter-productive to everything in the advocacy space and only goes to harm the improvement of motorcycling in SA.
We can, therefore, no longer allow the MRASA to remain in it's current black box form, devoid of communication, consultation, engagement and development within its own, or the wider motorcycling community if we are to seek the optimal level for representation for motorcycling in SA.
We therefore need to strengthen it, with new committee members, an increased membership and new ideas.
But we need your help to that.
We need you need to join the MRASA this month and then vote (or proxy vote) at the next AGM in February for new committee candidates… or optionally, for any existing MRASA members, support this initiative for a new committee and again, vote for new committee members.
~ What a new Committee will do ~
Should our candidates be successfully voted in, our immediate priorities will be to
- Instigate an internal member review (feedback survey) to ascertain member satisfaction, wants and needs of MRASA members.
- Instigate a Rider Awareness Week campaign in line with other jurisdictions.
- Develop a sub-committee to liaise with, and host, representatives from other motorcycling groups including online social groups, owner groups and other external advocacy groups.
- Instigate live streaming of general meetings to allow remote and regional members to participate in real time.
- Deploy a new content management system to host the MRASA website, making it mobile friendly, more easily accessible and with more content.
- Review membership pricing and options (similar to VMC, i.e. some membership packages may include roadside assistance, other levels may be cheaper)
- Rewrite the constitution to be more robust, specifying committee roles, separate roles and maximum tenure of roles.
- Remove 'committee approval' requirement for membership, making it immediate, but also include a dismissal and appeals process within the constitution.
- Investigate and apply for government and community grants to run rider awareness activities to the wider community.
- Review and optimise organisational income and expenditures.
- Seek member and community consultation on what core goals it would like to see the MRASA undertake next.
- Reopen the MRASA Facebook page to comments and discussion.
- Ensure the new MRASA committee works in alignment with the aims of the constitution.
~ What about the Existing MRASA functions ~
All existing MRASA programs and groups will remain in place and not be shuttered. They will continue to receive the full support of the new MRASA committee (and we would hope the existing leadership for these groups choose to remain on in place).
This includes the
- 4B's
- SAMRATS
- SAScoots
- Ridden on Run
- Blood Run
~ Final Thoughts ~
Beyond that, I also want to state that RTR members are fully aware of the significance of what we are attempting to undertake and achieve.
The MRASA has a long and rich history of achieving great outcomes for motorcyclists in this State and we do not attempt to cheapen or belittle their efforts. Their time, like ours, has been given freely and without reward, and, at the end of the day, we're all fighting for the same thing, better outcomes for motorcyclists.
Therefore, this upcoming vote, it's your chance to have your voice heard on how you think we can best achieve that... and it's a clear choice between the MRASA continuing to operate as it always has, or optionally, putting in a new team that will open up the MRASA to the same level of community consultation and inclusion that has driven the success of RTR.
Finally, in the lead up to the AGM in February I will be announcing our committee candidates with a short bio and the positions they are running for… and as always, any feedback, questions, comments or criticisms are all welcome.
Cheers
Tim


The MRA received dozens of new membership applications (with payment) in a very short time, a number were processed, a lot were never processed and constitutional by laws were amended to prevent new members standing for committee unless they'd been a member for minimum 12 months.



I'm not sure if memberships have been rejected formally or just not processed, a number that were processed have withdrawn their membership in disgust, at this stage I'm not sure I'll renew my or Kaylah's membership next year. The current committee have been heard to complain that there is no one new to take over and that's why they've been there so long. IMHO, they have in the past done a awesome job but it is time for change in leadership with new blood desperately needed.

It's a real shame because I believe someone with Tim's passion, energy and commitment was exactly what the MRA needed to breath new life into what was (and still should be) a fantastic organisation that has gone stagnant, IMHO it would have been a win - win
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Re: Adelaide City Council footpath parking trial - Survey

Post  paul on Sat 13 May 2017, 1:18 pm

I had heard of rite to ride , but not this mob ...............I must get out more , LOL  ..........Job well done to them . cheers ( I will have to sneak on Sue's FB & check them out Laughing  )

I had thought the MRA were changing way back when they started charging for the toy run ...............not because they were charging ,we can all appreciate it cost lots to put on , but the way it was handled seemed ( to me anyway ) to have an air of arrogance to it they never used to have .The trouble when the same people are left in charge of an organisation  for a long time , is they eventually think it's theirs .

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Re: Adelaide City Council footpath parking trial - Survey

Post  Chook on Sat 13 May 2017, 3:44 pm

If RTR becomes a registered body, I'd pay to join, at least I'd be pretty confident of getting something more than a sticker or 2 each year for my $$
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